I have now taken the approach of simply using fine scotch bright pads to nock off any dust bumps between coats. The woodworking club, that I am a member of, builds kid size tables and chairs as fundraisers at markets and shows. Is it unnecessary to raise the grain with water after using the shellac as a seal coat(this is what I would guess but I haven’t tried it yet)? So old pieces can become quite difficult to match when using new materials. Just sanded an old table to use as a desk. Thanks. Although, I have heard about some people successfully experimenting with the “shellac sandwich,” which entails shellac UV top and base coats with a regular nail polish of choice in between. Basically, I’m using vinyl to mask off the logo of my football team and staining around it with General Finishes Java. Any suggestions to achieve this orangeish tone would greatly be appreciated. When a hardwood floor is waxed, there’s a significant buildup of pure wax on top. (I understand Mark would not approve of this at all :-) ). Thanks!!! I am a first-timer and old old as dirt. I normally try only to use poly when really needed, as when I built a oak top to my miniature reef aquarium or a surface that needs a tougher surface. I will probably pour into glass quart jars and seal well. Probably should have worked the other way around! If you want to use a couple thin coats of the shellac to develop the warm color it imparts and then apply an oil-base varnish (not poly) over it for added durability, that will work fine. Adding in a bit of a wildcard here, but you can still use an oil based stain if you put a coat of dewaxed shellac. If you want to see the project I used this on, it’s #37456 at LumberJocks. These finishes are holding on for dear life! I gutted out the process and they turned out pretty good. Internet searches are making my head spin! Put the lid back on the can of shellac. I am scared to death afer all that work to put poly over it now!!! We have a cottage style home, so imprefections are welcome! :). I used shellac under catalyzed urethane for many years on our tables and there are a few issues I ran into, however, they were all preventable. Can I topcoat it with shellac over the tung oil? The Poly should be very rigid, but the shellac is pretty flexible. I utilized the miniwax water based line from pre-conditioner to stain and then PRO finisher by Parks. If you discover a missed spot do not attempt to touch it up. I think I was better off when I didn’t know it was wrong. A few light coats should do the trick. Not enough sealer and the stain will blotch. Thanks for opening the can of worms and letting us all fish. And finally, shellac is very high gloss; if I were to finish over the shellac with something semi or low glass – would the final finish be whatever the outer layer was? Why? I fear oil poly will yellow so I would love to be confident with water base. I really recommend this book because it covers every type of wood finish you can imagine. I was also thinking of using the Zinsser Bullseye SealCoat instead of using both a pre-stain and then a sanding sealer. Chris Marshall: And just to add to what Rob suggests, you can use shellac to seal in any other wood finish as well, plus wood stains, odors and naturally occurring oils or resins in the wood that might bleed. Using both duct tape and Scotch tape over a grid work of slices made with an X-acto knife, no lifting of the finish was observed on any of the boards. The Wood Whisperer is proudly sponsored by brands that Marc trusts. Thanks Vicki. Then sanding after 3-4 coats of poly. Water based primer ( aka Latex Paint Primer ) We used Zinsser 123 water based primer. HELP. Seeing that there was no going back I just went ahead and put the poly on top and hoped for the best. If so, are there any steps that I should take to prepare the tung oil for the shellac? I have been sanding had to replace some bad boards and haven’t been able to match the that old school pine aging. Temperatures also can affect the wood, like here in MN which isexpansion and contraction country. You can make something from the raw ingredients fairly easily, if you want more tips feel free to ask. It may not happen every time, or with every formulation of urethane either. The look didn’t match the effort. I find it interesting and educational. The topcoat will be water poly. It is, however, OK to use an oil-based urethane over shellac. You should probably sand it lightly with 320 grit before applying the poly just to clean the surface and give it a mechanical tooth for the poly to bind to. That was a great demo. And I have used several coats of non-dewaxed shellac under the poly just to get to the right shade on some pieces. No change in the results. To answer that question, I decided to do a little experiment for myself. And it is certainly more convenient. I’ve just built a kitchen cabinet for trash and in the process of testing out different. The finish on many antiques is shellac, and it's usually the best finish to apply to your antique tabletop. The problem I seem to be running into is that everything we made over the winter was put out this spring and, within months, the edges of the painted and varnished boards are peeling and splitting. Poly, lacquer, waterbased poly…. Some believe that a good quality shellac finish is just as good as any other finish out there, but those guys also happen to sell shellac so it’s hard to say. Not to be one to learn quickly, I repeated the performance a few years later with the same results. When refinishing floors, cannot splice or fan a finish in if the customer has been waxing their floors. Even though you can put regular nail polish over shellac, don’t ever put shellac over regular nail polish – It won’t cure right. Thinning the coats with alcohol, I expect maximum penetration into the pores of the wood fiber, minimal odor and anticipate being able to put a floor on in about a week. On softwood, you may want to give a wash coat of thinned shellac before staining. I think they are saying, “just don’t sue me..”. Good idea to get everyone thinking about their finishing process. Thanks for taking the time to do it. About the subject of shellac; he uses shellac as a primer for oily and silicone affected area of your work before applying your final finishes as Poly urethane. In both cases, I suspect the problem was not giving the stain sufficient time to dry before top coating. Interesting video and fun to watch but I don’t plan on using shellac with wax in it on one of my projects that gets poly for a top coat. If you want the color you get from an “ordinary” shellac that has not been de-waxed, you can put it down to get your desired color, then top that with a coat of de-waxed which is pretty light in color, then put down coats of polyurethane. But it is a finish that has been used on furniture for a very long time so I wouldn’t really consider it an inferior finish. 5 Answers. Thank you so much for this video! Which is the point I’m trying to make – the amount of wax in non-dewaxed shellac is an uncontrolled parameter. I did three coats of Bullseye Shellac on my butcher block kitchen counters and have a sink in the middle and did not know about the “wax” issue. I posted a link to my blog for my Before pictures. And under those conditions, I saw no immediate failure. But you have to find the right balance. Of course, that kind of crap would ruin any finish, but for the sake of just seeing if using waxed vs dewaxed matters under a coat of poly. Just brainstorming…. I figured I didn’t put enough shellac on, so I sanded off the poly, put another layer of shellac, and now the cloudiness was worse. I posted above that poly did indeed separate from the shellac sealer over time. In which case, random tests would not be conclusive. Thanks for doing this test and showing the results Marc. The shellac does away with the blotchy finish of stain on raw pine. True true. Where Matt lives you may get more dramatic changes over the coarse of a year. Here’s a quick link for you: Slight blue cast. Put the samples in the hot sun. And of course I know you mean no disrespect. I once tried poly over a previously waxed hardwood floor. Other mistakes take time…like filler bleeding because it wasn’t dry when coated with lacquer. Thank you again. Helps to be focused on other tasks. Keep them coming. As for more videos on finishing, try the Finish category in the archive. Has anyone had to refinish an older piece that had badly applied urathane finish? I bought a can of Zinsser Shellac from Home Depot and after getting home read the label which said not a suitable for undercoating waterborne poly. To the best of my knowledge, there is little that you can not put over shellac. This is the only sanding sealer you will ever need! I know the molding in my parents home was cypress in some rooms and some were American chestnut now extinct. Thanks for all the posts. That will give folks the opportunity to help you in a more efficient conversational way. Enjoyed that short video and test thanks Marc. In my experience, shellac has an extremely long shelf life because you can almost always reconstitute it with denatured alcohol. Mr. Wood Whisperer, I have 2 floors left and I am anxious to try you shellac idea because I think this would have been a better solution. Can I put a clear top coat of lacquer or shellac over acrylic paint. Same shallow angle ( maybe ~20 more tips feel free to ask strengthened all the people ’ #... 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